What is the narrative difference between a Charisma and Wisdom saving throw?

Question

Relatively few spells in D&D 5e require a Charisma saving throw, and when they do it's often difficult to describe the in-game reasons for why they require such a throw.

One of my players told me that the Charisma saving throw for Banishment is essentially a check on the target's sheer "force of will" to remain in their present plane.

This clashes with my understanding of what a Wisdom saving throw entails. I've always imagined that the Wisdom saving throws for spells like Geas and Dominate Person were also a check on the target's "force of will".

Is there any narrative explanation for the difference between a Charisma and Wisdom saving throw? What is the in-game difference between Wisdom and Charisma in terms of willpower?

If both saving throws are related to willpower, then why are they treated as distinct saving throws?

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To clarify: I'm not interested in the gameplay differences between the two saving throws. Clearly they have different purposes in terms of balance. What I'm more concerned with is how they relate differently to willpower.

Answer 1

It's unclear but...

Looking at the definitions provided for Wisdom and Charisma on the abilities page, there is not a clear definition of saving throws listed for the abilities.

Wisdom

Wisdom reflects how attuned you are to the world around you and represents perceptiveness and intuition.

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Charisma

Charisma measures your ability to interact effectively with others. It includes such factors as confidence and eloquence, and it can represent a charming or commanding personality.

Like you, I have also heard and read of Charisma as a sort of 'force of personality', though I'm having trouble finding that in a source book. In any case, I think what we need to turn to is the spell lists that require each type of throw.

For PHB Spells that require wisdom saving throws, we see things like: Charm Person, Command, Compulsion, Dominate Person, Enthrall, Hideous Laughter, and Polymorph.

For PHB Spells that require charisma saving throws, we see things like: Banishment, Calm Emotions, Planar Binding and Seeming.

Clearly there is some overlap, but I think we can draw some rough boundaries.

When making a Wisdom saving throw, you are retaining your attunement to reality by resisting magical effects that attempt to trick you into behaving differently than you would normally, or take advantage of your unconscious. On a failure, your intuition has failed and you cannot correctly perceive the world as it truly is. An enemy is a friend or master instead. For the spell Scrying you are attuned enough to the forces of magic that you can detect an incoming spy and resist it.

When making a Charisma saving throw, you are using your force of personality to resist a physical alteration of the world. On a failure, your confidence is shattered so much that you are physically banished or restrained. You have lost your command of reality.

Ultimately though, you are correct. It is a fine line.

Answer 2

They are not "both willpower". They're as different from one another as they are from a DEX or STR save.

I know that's blunt, but it's an important lead-in to any answer to this question. The mistaken premise here is that you are defining these explicitly distinct qualities in terms of an analogy (that each equals willpower in some sense), and then are building a syllogism based on those simultaneous analogies which would suggest that CHA and WIS are the same thing.

They aren't. There is not a stat called Willpower used for all of these purposes. There are two distinct stats used for different purposes. Any investigation which begins with "they're the same, so how are they different?" is going to be challenging.

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At their cores, CHA and WIS represent fundamentally different ideas. Charisma is not about force of will but about force of personality. A charismatic character can inspire people to follow them or to agree with them or to believe them.

A sufficiently specified character can produce similar effects on reality itself-- that's how a sorcerer is different from a wizard. The wizard studies reality and the Weave, learns how they interact, and then follows known steps to manipulate the Weave to produce effects in the world. A sorcerer doesn't know any of that stuff, and instead sort of intuitively persuades the Weave to impose an effect on reality in a manner they choose. Sorcerers are filled with magical power and they rely on their charisma to direct it. Wizards are filled with proven knowledge and then apply it.

Wisdom is the ability to discern relationships between things and gather insight into them. Wisdom is about understanding the world around oneself. Wisdom isn't at all about imposing one's will on reality (even for wise characters that want to do so, the wisdom itself doesn't directly cause or direct changes). It's about understanding what reality is and ought to be, along with understanding the implications of things being otherwise.

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Spells with CHA saves tend to be about imposing a change on reality, with the target accepting or resisting that change. Think of Banishment: the caster is attempting to literally change the plane of existence on which its target... exists. The target can assert their will to resist that change. It's not about understanding what's happening to them, it's about refusing to let that thing happen.

WIS saves are more about understanding what's going on. When an Illusionist whips up an illusory boulder in the air above a target, the target's wisdom allows them to connect the dots: this isn't how the world behaves, with boulders just appearing in midair, so that boulder may not be real. A high WIS saving throw means their understanding was deep enough to pierce the illusion, while a lower saving throw indicates they aren't totally convinced but not so strongly as to break the illusion.

As an alternative for the boulder case, an INT response might be something more like sitting down and calculating all the specific things about the boulder and its appearance that don't seem to fit with normal reality and then precisely deducing its likely illusory quality. That may be hard to apply in a saving throw situation, though.

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There was an amazing analogy posted in an answer to another question on this stack which I was unable to find and reference properly. This partial analogy is not mine, and I would be happy to attribute it to its actual author.

Wisdom is about knowing that tomatoes don't belong in a fruit salad (whether they are technically a fruit or not). Charisma is about making a fruit salad that everyone loved, whether the tomatoes in it belonged or not.

Answer 3

What I'm more concerned with is how they relate differently to willpower.

In former editions, there were even feats to exchange one for the other (or their bonuses at least).

For a lengthy and good explanation, please also read the other answers. This one is not meant to contradict them but to deliver a very short, graphic and slightly exaggerated narrative of the difference.

Using your willpower (aka Wisdom):

You want me to jump into the gaping chasm of fiery death?

Even if you claim that it is not, that sounds dangerous and harmful. I won't do that.

Using your force of personality (aka Charisma):

You want me to jump into the gaping chasm of fiery death?

Who the hell do you think you are to tell me what to do? I will jump when I say so and not one moment earlier.