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I have a rules question for Fortitude 6: Personal Armor from Vampire: the Masquerade, 20th Anniversary Edition.

A hand-to-hand attack causes the attacker equal damage to that suffered by the defender when Personal Armor comes into play. If the attacker misses entirely, she still takes one level of bashing damage.

Does the attacker receive the full amount of damage from their damage roll, or the amount after soaking?

Arguments for "full":

  • Otherwise, the damage received by the attacker would benefit from both the attacker and defender's soak rolls, which would seem unusual.
  • Elsewhere in the description of this power, where the shattering of melee weapons is described, it reads "The vampire still takes normal damage if the attack is successful, even if the weapon shatters in the process, though this damage may be soaked.", which suggests that "takes damage" or "suffers damage" refers to the damage roll and not the results of the soak roll.
  • Considering "If the attacker misses entirely, she still takes one level of bashing damage.", that would mean that the attacker could successfully hit and take zero damage if all of the damage dealt to the target were soaked. Potentially taking more damage by missing doesn't make much sense.

Arguments for "post-soak":

  • "Damage suffered" sure sounds like "damage received and not soaked".
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1 Answer 1

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Pre-Soak for Both Parties

Personal Armor

Nobody likes to get hit, not even Cainites. The easiest way to ensure that one is not hit (or shot, or stabbed) repeatedly is to take the weapon with which one is assaulted away from one’s attacker and break it. That’s where Personal Armor comes in. This application of Fortitude, derived from one popular in the 12th century, causes anything that strikes a Kindred who employs Personal Armor to shatter on impact. System: With the expenditure of two blood points, a vampire can add preternatural hardness to his flesh. Every time an attack is made on the Kindred using Personal Armor (one which he fails to dodge), his player rolls Fortitude (difficulty 8). If the roll grants more successes than the attacker rolled, then the weapon used to make the attack shatters against the vampire’s flesh. (“Magical” weapons may be resistant to this effect, at the Storyteller’s discretion.) The vampire still takes normal damage if the attack is successful, even if the weapon shatters in the process, though this damage may be soaked. If the attack roll botches, any normal weapon automatically shatters. A hand-to-hand attack causes the attacker equal damage to that suffered by the defender when Personal Armor comes into play. If the attacker misses entirely, she still takes one level of bashing damage. The effects of this power last for the duration of the scene.

Combat Stage Three: Resolution

  • Determine total damage effect (weapon type or maneuver), adding any extra dice gained from successes on the attack roll.
  • Targets may attempt to soak damage, if possible.

Since a weapon can shatter, but a body shouldn't (unless we talk Extras), we're talking about reflecting the damage back on the attacker and seeing how much they in turn break. Damage totaling happens before the soak in combat resolution.

The same raw damage roll applies to both attacker and defender, both soaking respectively. A hit resulting in 0 damage successes would be soaked by both parties, and a miss would be 1B that they can soak

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