Checking in with the Lavender community

TLDR: I feel less welcome, and I don't think it's fixable.

I'm trans, and currently only partially out to friends and family, not yet out at work. (Some of Rebecca's answers have been very helpful to me in this process.)

For years, Stack Exchange in general, and particularly one of the medium-size sites closely connected to my work, have been a very meaningful community for me. It's not like I've formed any close personal friendships, and I'm not a mod, but I've learned a lot, I've helped a pretty decent number of people, and there are a significant number of users who I respect and think of as part of my broader work community. I've also had a large number of people I know in professional contexts tell me that they have seen many of my answers on here; my main account uses my real name.

Then, all of this happened. When I first ran across it, a few days into the initial flurry of meta posts, I was mostly reading it just as "ooh, drama." Then as I realized what it was about, I got more invested. So invested, in fact, that I ended up coming out to the friend whose couch I was reading it on at the time, to explain just why I was so invested. (This was going to happen soon anyway, it was just the impetus.)

In these early phases, I was like everyone else upset about the company's actions. I was also uneasy with a few of the responses, which were quite invalidating to trans people (especially, but definitely not exclusively, nonbinary people). But I was able to explain it to myself as mostly about Monica's mistreatment, outside of a few weirdos, and of course that is mostly what it was about at that point.

Then came the COC update + pronouns FAQ. To my reading, even the initial one was clearly well-intentioned and more-or-less reasonable. There were some issues, to be sure. But in my point of view (and this is please not the space to have those arguments), they were mostly relatively minor issues, and/or people nit-picking aspects of the rules in the worst possible light. Some of that is natural on a site that's largely made of programmers. Some of that is natural given the frame of mind people had entering into this after the debacle with Monica (and relicensing, and HNQ, and...).

But the overwhelming unanimity of opposition to the FAQ felt largely, to me, as if the broad consensus on StackExchange is that the challenges of trans people just do not matter. I don't want to argue about whether this is true for most people; that's how it felt.

But for me personally, coming from a position of (by global standards) extreme privilege, and with my career in a reasonable place, trans issues are the main thing I worry about every day. Will society at large, and my peer groups in particular, accept me – not only not vocally denouncing me, not only saying supportive things when I come out to them, but actually treating me as a full human being worthy of respect?

I got in a few arguments about this around the site. Nothing that, if you go through my comment history, will seem very extreme. Nothing that I felt like should have been deleted, though a few of my comments were (I think questionably, though I understand why they were). No outright severe transphobia, like I know many people have gotten, because I wasn't very "out there."

(I got a little bit of outright transphobia on the question I made this account for last year, but it was quickly deleted and didn't really stick with me. It doesn't bother me so much that a few random internet people are full-on transphobes; I already know this very well.)

What hurt, mostly, was the arguments with a few users who had been in the "person I respect and think of as part of my community" bucket. There was nothing necessarily terrible about these. Nothing that I felt I needed to flag for a mod (and indeed I know the conversations were read by several mods). But not only were these users I respected, in my opinion, trivializing these things that to me are significant harms, it seemed like they had the majority of public opinion on their side in a community I formerly felt welcome in.

The comment votes have since evened out a bit, but the seeming widespread acceptance that "coercing" people into accepting me and others like me as a person is so much more of a problem than the core challenge in my life right now feels exceedingly unwelcoming.

(There's a good explanation here of why the "compelled speech" argument feels so invalidating.)

I know to a lot of people this doesn't feel like a real issue. And indeed, I'm not too bothered by the constant barrage of transphobic news stories (especially in England for a while, now ramping up in Scotland/Australia/New Zealand, ...), and am sometimes amused by outright transphobes on Twitter.

But having this community, that I felt like part of and has substantial overlap with people in my career, mildly reject me? That sucks.

It's happened more than once in the past month that I've been browsing meta in the office in the afternoon and gotten so upset that I needed to just go home.

I have literally cried about this in therapy.

^{(Though I'm still getting used to increased estrogen levels and generally cry a lot more than I used to.)}

I'm not, for now, disengaging from Stack Exchange. I'm still answering questions on my main account. But I'm avoiding meta, I'm spending less time browsing on HNQ, and I definitely feel less welcome.

I don't know if there's really anything anyone can do about that.

1. Do people feel they are, or will be, safer and/or more welcome, for example?

   I transitioned years ago. Nowadays I'm aware that people (on the internet or otherwise) who stir up trouble do it because of unfamiliarity. When most people meet me in real life, including (and sometimes especially) conservative types, they seem to just "get it" in their own way.

   It's different for people on the internet, who don't meet transgender people in person: they might not "get it". Some treat transgender identities as some kind of game, not a human being's actual life. When someone misuses or mocks pronouns, it's a small reminder that I am considered inferior. Unfortunately, the recent situation has promoted much pronoun mocking, but hopefully it'll settle down. Like most websites: don't read the comments.

   The diamond moderators may not be familiar with transgender people, so I don't know if they will "get it". If I report something, will they understand? Maybe, maybe not, but a lot of people in the past have not understood, and often make it worse. Having something concrete in the CoC indeed makes me feel more welcome.

   Feeling safe is different to feeling welcome. I'm aware there are people on the internet who are willing to spend a considerable chunk of their lives lowering the quality of life of transgender people. They are reported as doing things like contact that person's employer, family members, doctors, etc., and provide them with carefully curated anti-transgender material. Maybe one day they will come after me. There are no rules that Stack Exchange could concoct that could protect me from this. I never truly feel safe anywhere.

   However, over time I have come to understand the real-life world is nicer than the internet makes it seem. When someone's newly transitioned, it's scarier, whereas nowadays I'm very much established as a woman. I use my real name as my username.

2. Do the changes made seem adequate from trans users' point of view, at least as a first step?

   The relevant part of the CoC seems okay in my view, it's succinct and doesn't draw attention to transgender people specifically. By this, I'm referring to:

   Use stated pronouns (when known). When in doubt, don't use language that might offend or alienate.

   It'd be nice to also be firmer against pronoun mocking, but one step at a time. I'm guessing pronoun mocking will become less popular when non-transgender users are willing to respond "you're not being clever; you're being a dick" (in today's vernacular). Perhaps currently it's considered "edgy" or "original" or something.

3. It isn't clear what the status of the request that sensitivity training be made available is. Is that fact a source of consternation? Etc.

   Sensitivity training may backfire, further polarizing users. I don't consider this a top priority: if it's going to be implemented, it needs to be done carefully. In the meantime, there seems to be transgender people on Meta.SE who are willing to chip in.

Perhaps starting a "gender and sexuality" Stack Exchange site might help. (I asked about it on Area 51 here.) However, Sexuality has failed in the past: not once, but twice. But these sites seemed more about having sex.

I got invited to answer this post. I wrote this very quickly in that sort of heated frustration you get into. If you find typos or feel like links should be added, comment or edit (and thank you).

1. Do people feel they are, or will be, safer and/or more welcome, for example?

Let me change this question: "Do people feel they are safe [as it stands]?" Nope. Not at all. There's been someone who posted that they were targeted by neo-Nazis, which is nice and terrifying. I've seen transphobic comments all over the place. A question, not deleted until four hours plus after it was posted, on meta said (basically a direct quote), "the LGBTQ+ community is the source of the problem." LGBTQ+ moderators and users are leaving and resigning (legitimately! who wants to stay in a not-safe space? I have my reasons, but often I've been questioning why they are sufficient) leaving less LGBTQ+ people to help fight for what is necessary.

The worst part? People are focusing on Monica [note: Monica's pain is major and needs to be resolved; please read this with the fact in mind that I support Monica's quest for reinstatement wholeheartedly]. Aza's resignation wasn't noticed until Monica's thing blew up. A moderator who said some absolutely outrageous stuff a couple months (might be more) ago [can't share, TL, etc, etc; suffice it to say it was far more egregious and offensive than anything Monica said] had, as far as I can tell, zero consequences in spite of multiple complaints. I'm not the only one saying things aren't safe. People have been saying there's problems over and over for years. Has SE been paying attention? Nope. Not until now, and they're not doing a great job of it right now. [Note: CMs are wonderful. Thank them for the work they do.]

When the news about Monica broke, the vitriol was tremendous. Half the meta mods had resigned/were inactive. Those that were left were overwhelmed. People like me, including me, were flagging, were responding, were trying to stem the tide. No help. Didn't work very well. I'd thought I was pretty welcome here. I can basically see now that for a reasonable percentage of the SE population, I am not.

This is not the fault of the CoC. This is the fault of a much deeper rot. In that, I appreciate the CoC for finally beginning to deal with these issues. But the way SE just abandoned the situation when it started to burn hurt. The way SE hasn't listened to the complaints we've made in the past or now hurts. Safe? Welcome? Right now, nope. In the future? Maybe, but it's going to take work.

2. Do the changes made seem adequate from trans users' point of view, at least as a first step?

I like the new CoC. I think it's good and appropriate. Definitely a good first step (though there's many more to be taken).

3. It isn't clear what the status of the request that sensitivity training be made available is. Is that fact a source of consternation? Etc.

I feel like this is a good place to point out that on the meta post where the mod letters (including the lavender letter) were posted, Sara Chipps wrote "thanks for this, we will be writing a response very soon" - that was October 8th. Needless to say, there has been no response.

I saw a lot of moderators fall somewhere between outright hurtful to genuinely confused. That's why someone thoughtfully suggested required sensitivity training for mods, and I think it's really a fantastic idea. Mods have actually requested it before, but of course nobody even paid attention to it until there was a fire (oh, wait, SE still hasn't paid very much attention to it).

It seems like a simple, immediately actionable thing that would improve things. The consternation here largely rises from the fact that there's been no conversation about it or acknowledgement of it.

Why do I stay? It's because I love modding. I love writing and answering questions. I've learned so much here, and (hopefully) I've taught a few people something here. I love the community I mod, Quantum Computing, and a couple of others, like Physics and Literature. I love a lot of the people. I have felt like my age did not affect the seriousness with which people took my words. Except now, apparently, something else is.

This issue is not resolved.

It will not be resolved until the LGBTQ+ community feels welcome, because the broader community is welcoming.

It will not be resolved until people, especially SE, listens.

What do you think are the odds of that happening?

Do people feel they are, or will be, safer and/or more welcome, for example?

No, I don't feel safer/more welcome. When I'm posting on 'neutral topics' on sites I frequently post on, no problem ; and there never has been, even when questions specifically address the representation of LGBTQ+ individuals, which is on-topic for one of those sites -- the moderators there have got my back, even if their personal views might be at odds -- about which frankly I have no idea, as they don't let them affect their actions.

Elsewhere the question hasn't come up: Lua and VBA, Pets and Gardening tend not to open the topic -- although I noted a tone change in the responses to my questions on the technical sites when I switched from a username without gender connotations to one that included the damning word 'girl' -- which is off topic here, but I will say I'm big bad and old enough to snort with laughter and move on. 40-odd years of active feminism gives you sufficient armour to identify and ignore the [fill in your choice of perjorative noun here].

But on Meta, I'm treading on eggshells all the time -- Will this post attract the trolls? Am I prepared to deal with them? Have I expressed my opinion in a sufficiently guarded manner that the mob won't howl in outrage if it isn't the popular opinion?

And yes, I'm characterizing some (not most) of what I've seen here over the last 4-6 weeks as a mob -- I've seen and held rational discussions that involved a number of participants; but also observed and tried not to participate in less structured discussions that make no pretence to respect alternative viewpoints. It's hard to feel safe/comfortable when it appears that the 'wrong' opinion will result not in disagreement but vituperation. (And that's before we get to the trolls). With the exception of the trolls (and that -- I hope -- very few who are genuinely opposed to welcoming LGBTQ+ individuals), the members of the apparent 'mob' might want to reflect on this fact: "four legs good two legs bad" is not a welcoming ethos. Let's talk, rationally; we might have to agree to disagree. But we don't have to make anyone miserable or scared.

Right now, I'm scared to participate here without a censor looking over my shoulder.

• Pay attention to complaints of disrespect by LGBTQ+ users

I do feel like SE Inc is listening to our concerns and complaints, but I also feel like they aren't really responding (or at least, not enough).

Some time ago, I wrote this question and I find it frustrating that SE Inc hasn't officially responded to it (directly, by posting an answer or indirectly, by posting something else somewhere visible for everyone).

I know SE Inc is paying attention and care about us. But I know that because I have seen multiple tiny signs. What saddens me here is that those signs are, indeed, tiny and that other members of the lavender community may not have seen them. I don't want members of the lavender community to feel like SE doesn't care (enough) about them. I don't want to feel that way either.

That's why I wish they would have made a post about it. Maybe they fear that talking about the recent event will just add more fuel to the fire (especially since they can't talk about the Monica situation because of all the lawyer stuff). Maybe they are very right to fear that. But still, I wish they would talk about it and acknowledge our pain.

1. Do people feel they are, or will be, safer and/or more welcome, for example?

I definitively believe that this new CoC will make me safer (at some point... in the future... when the dust will have settled down...). However, for now, MSE is still burning with hatred and I don't feel really safe here at all. However, I do feel mostly safe on the rest of the network, which is nice.

2. Do the changes made seem adequate from trans users' point of view, at least as a first step?

As I said, I do believe that the new CoC will make things better, so yes.

3. It isn't clear what the status of the request that sensitivity training be made available is. Is that fact a source of consternation? Etc.

As far as I know, "sensitivity training" isn't something that is really done in my home country (France). So, not having it isn't a "consternation" to me. It's just the "normal" way of things.

However, I always loved the idea of such training. I have no idea what it could look like, but I fully support the idea of having such a thing. I would, myself, love to have such a training (even if I'm not a moderator).

• Consequences for disrespect should be clearer

I have always find that the consequence of violating some rules weren't clear on SE (I'm on the autism spectrum. I really want things to be very clear). So, really, this hasn't changed much.

• Consequences for disrespect should be [..] applied consistently

I'm not a moderator. I don't know who is punished for what. But I have heard things and I'm not really optimist about the fact that this is currently the case. I still do hope that it will be at some point, though.