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A while ago I asked in this post; if continuing to support the community by performing review tasks and such was a good idea. At the time I personally thought it was.

Today SE stopped being a community, when they decided the community could not use the site to look after the needs of members of the community.

Why is SE removing links and community ads about legal issues?

If you had not stopped monitoring and protecting the site before, maybe it is time to stop now?

Also related Is Stack Exchange in violation of New York labor law, in using volunteer moderators?

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  • 42
    Please don't tell me how to advocate on behalf of the users of my sites and my fellow moderators.
    – HDE 226868
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 18:22
  • 16
    Drama is behind us, so lets forget about all the issues that caused it, right? No need to hold anyone accountable.
    – Oded
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 19:17
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    @Oded - Is the drama behind actually us? We have not even seen the new Code of Conduct, which resulted in a discussion to happen, resulting in a moderator being fired. SE has not even had a discussion with that moderator after they issued a second apology apology.
    – Ramhound
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 19:43
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    @Ramhound - I don't believe it is, but it feels that's what the post would like things to be like.
    – Oded
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 19:56
  • @Oded - I am bad at reading sarcasm in text. My apolgizes
    – Ramhound
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 19:57
  • @Ramhound - no worries. Text is not a great format for expressing such things.
    – Oded
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 19:58
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    Is this post just about judging people that got hurt lately, telling them they allow too much mess by doing nothing while being hurt, and then giving orders to the entire community? Looks like a nice way to get everything back on tracks...
    – dim
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 20:34
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    Why would you expect someone to continue to volunteer their time and expertise to a company who acts in a way they don't support? Why would I continue to invest myself it what may essentially turn out to be an abusive relationship? This isn't the first time the company has apologized and promised to do better - and failed to deliver on that promise.
    – ColleenV
    Commented Oct 8, 2019 at 22:33
  • @ColleenV if the manager of my apartment building is inappropriate in their duties, I am still going to secure my apartment, and take out the trash. I might plan to move, but until I do, I am still going to maintain my area.
    – James Jenkins
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 8:28
  • @JamesJenkins would you go clean other people’s apartments while the manager collects the fee for your work? And instead of thanking you for earning them that money, they call you a bigot? And all the while they’re evicting people without due process? It’s your life, so do what you want, but don’t push it on other people.
    – ColleenV
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 10:40
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    @ColleenV my position only applies to communities/apartments which you have an attachment to or co-ownership of.
    – James Jenkins
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 11:10
  • @JamesJenkins Maintaining these sites is work. It may be rewarding or not depending on who you are. When it ceases to be rewarding for someone, they should stop doing it and fill their time with something more rewarding. That’s how volunteering works.
    – ColleenV
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 14:24
  • @ColleenV No objections from me on that point.
    – James Jenkins
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 14:28
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    Interestingly enough, I am one of the mods who kept on moderating. However, I sense a grave injustice was done – a well-respected member of the community first unceremoniously booted without due process, and later maligned and slandered. The community is at a crossroads: roll over and take it, or demand that a wrong be made right. Based on past experiences in the Stack Exchange, I thought for sure this would be fixed in a couple days at most, but the longer it drags on, the more disenchanted I become. If what we had in the past had value, let's stick to our principles.
    – J.R. means 'Just Reinstate'
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 21:16
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    I don't think the massive edit you did is helpful. You probably should preserve the original and add an edit to the top or something like that if you feel so strongly about it.
    – Skooba
    Commented Nov 14, 2019 at 19:15

1 Answer 1

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I get where you're coming from, and it's quite true that those on strike, myself included, appear to be leaving the sites and people we care about to the dogs - if you look at things without context. But . . .

  • The users benefit from my moderating, but not if they're leaving the sites - and a number of them are. Anything I can do to stop that is a boon to those users and to the community as a whole.
  • I benefit from my moderating, but not if it's an emotional drain or a source of stress, as it has been for me for about ten days. Eventually, things will return to normal, emotionally, but that's not going to happen tomorrow.
  • Stack Exchange benefits from my moderating, but they're recently made various decision I strongly disagree with, so that's not a motivating factor. I'm less inclined to do volunteer work for a group which has taken actions which treat some of those I care about unfairly.

I do see your point, but I think the situation is more nuanced and less open-and-shut than you make it out to be.

I write this addendum about two weeks later. I feel now that the time I've spent on Meta Stack Exchange - time I would otherwise have spent moderating - has been extremely productive and beneficial for me. I've had the chance to listen to a whole bunch of folks who don't agree about anything, and I've been able to contribute, in tiny ways, to trying to dig us out of this hole. I haven't come up with any big solutions, but I've been able to keep throwing stuff at the wall and seeing if it sticks.

Looking at the last month, my sites are the better for me making that decision, albeit in indirect - even hidden - ways. And, fortunately, they're all still running. They might be on fire, yes, and that's not great, but they're were already on fire - and right now we're all working to put that fire out.

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  • I have not been following every nuance. I concur 100% that if your volunteer work here is negatively impacting your life, you should take a step back. I also appreciate that in most cases, those stepping back have announced their actions and the reasons.
    – James Jenkins
    Commented Oct 9, 2019 at 11:16
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    I wonder how many moderators would be back at work with this whole fiasco in the rear-view mirror had the CTO had just added one last sentence to his eloquent apology: We are sorry we overstepped our bounds; Monica's moderation status has been reinstated on all four sites where she was moderating. Yes, there are other issues that still have people uneasy, but I still think this step would have quelled the turmoil almost immediately.
    – J.R. means 'Just Reinstate'
    Commented Oct 10, 2019 at 11:35
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    @J.R. s/four/six (just for the record)
    – Rand al'Thor
    Commented Oct 11, 2019 at 10:43
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    Is it really a strike if the each moderator came to their conclusion individually, without any collective discussion or collective agreement?
    – gerrit
    Commented Nov 21, 2019 at 16:09
  • @gerrit It's an interesting point, but there has been a good deal of discussion amongs the mods, as you might have seen, and that's swayed a number of minds, mine included. It's not like we all sat down and decided simultaneously to put our duties on hold, but the miscellaneous resignations/temporary breaks also aren't fully independent of one another, either.
    – HDE 226868
    Commented Nov 29, 2019 at 17:27
  • @HDE226868 There has been discussion, yes, but not a collective decision. In a real union, the latter is crucial for a strike to be declared (and in such a situation, I would abide by the majority decision even if I disagreed, e.g. if >50% of a quorate meeting of mods decided on a strike, I would join it regardless of my own views).
    – gerrit
    Commented Nov 30, 2019 at 15:05

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