1
\$\begingroup\$

There are of course equivalent circuit models for modeling practical passive components using idealized elementary circuit models that reflect the parasitic effects that occur at high frequencies , after some research I have an intuition that capacitor technologies (geometric shape and dielectric material of capacitors) play essential role in determining such parasitic effects in high frequencies , so my questions now :

  1. What are the methods and techniques for measuring the values of parasitic elements like in the following model of a practical capacitor (my example here is for capacitor but I need to learn a systematic way for all passive components R,L,C) - Either from datasheet or preferably using a test circuit

    Equivalent Model of Ceramic capacitor from Wikipedia page

  2. What are techniques to approximately solve (minimize as possible) these parasitic effects (ie moving the total value of impedance between the two terminals toward ideal values at higher frequencies like by adding series an/or parallel elements of different values and technologies - Example my be connecting an electrolytic capacitor in parallel with ceramic capacitor of lower value - please correct me here if I am wrong )

What I mean and expect here in an answer not a direct answer about the know-how it self about answering my questions , Rather than some advise about what Books/ references that treat this problem (titles , keywords or authors) or any other literature also it would be a great help to advise about the prerequisite topics that I should be familiar with before reading such material assuming I have knowledge in :

  • Electric Circuits (Nilson Book)
  • Electronics (Boylstadt Book)
  • Electromagnetics (Fawwaz Al Ulaby Book)

Also my research included finding books like the following on amazon , but am not sure it covers that kind of information and problem solving :

  • Capacitors : Technology and Trends (Deshpande Book)
  • Passive Components : Electrical and Electronic Engineering (Deshpande Book)

Am not sure also whether I need advanced topics like Microwave Engineering (Pozar Book)

\$\endgroup\$

2 Answers 2

1
\$\begingroup\$

The parasitic effects are not limited to passive components, also the PCB has parasitic effects. Copper wiring has inductance and two nearby wires couple magnetically. Two nearby wires with insulation between is a capacitor so wires have capacitive coupling.

1) Parasitics can just be measured and you can have an impedance curve, so there is no need to model the component with parasitics with a network of ideal components. Some manufacturers provide the impedance curves so you don't have to measure them.

2) If for example a capacitor has parasitic inductance and it works poorly at high frequency, then that can be compensated by putting a different capacitor nearby with different parasitics so the other capacitor handles lower frequencies and the other handles higher frequencies. This applies to other caps like two ceramic caps, not just for electrolytic paralleled with ceramics.

Also properly designing the PCB helps. This involves carefully planning where and with what limitations the components need to be placed, how far a capacitor can be put from an IC to still be effective, what PCB trace width should be used to minimize inductance and maximize capacitance if that is required, or even cutting out ground planes under components to minimize stray capacitance.

Even resistors have parasitic capacitance and inductance, and sometimes you need to put two resistors in series to have less stray capacitance between resistor terminals.

\$\endgroup\$
1
  • \$\begingroup\$ Note that, even given impedance data, an equivalent circuit can still be helpful: many SPICE transient simulators work poorly with frequency-domain data, but effortlessly with an RLC equivalent. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Aug 16, 2023 at 23:19
0
\$\begingroup\$

(1) Measure the impedance.

Make measurements at as many frequencies as needed for the application (including the maximum harmonics of signal frequencies), sampled as often as needed to get a "smooth" sampling of the function \$Z(F)\$.

An ideal two-terminal component, like an RLC, is a one-port, so this is a simple enough measurement, using a reflectance bridge for example, and as a passive (non amplifying) element, the impedance will be strictly positive-real. If the impedance differs widely from \$Z_0\$ (typically a 50Ω system is used, e.g. commercially available VNAs) in certain ranges, matching networks or other methods may be required to get adequate precision.

Apply the Padé approximant, obtaining a rational polynomial that best-fits the sampled data over the range desired. Increasing the order improves accuracy, to a point, beyond which additional fitting accentuates noise (errors in the measurements) and worsens interpolated and extrapolated results (adding a stipulation for some resistance at minimum and maximum frequencies may be helpful in this respect, at least to keep it from being too badly behaved).

This is essentially done, down to isomorphism, or to say the "solution is left as an exercise for the student". An RLC lumped-element circuit corresponds to a polynomial, and vice versa, give or take some flexibility in both spaces (for example, you can choose a parallel array of series RLC elements; or a series array of parallel RLC elements; or a ladder network; or etc.; the polynomial can be expressed as a straight rational, or factorized, or a continued fraction, etc.).

I'm not aware offhand of an algorithm to solve for a schematic based on an impedance plot, or polynomial, but that's not to say one cannot exist (clearly, a solution is possible, given the above; you might just not be able to enumerate every possible circuit (or class of circuit, given possible infinities) that fits the function).

(2) There is no general answer here, because:

a. Component parasitics are defined by component construction (length, aspect ratio, geometry, materials..) and cannot be changed in-circuit.
b. Where series or parallel combinations are acceptable, one or another impedance can be made to dominate over some frequency range, but they can only share when their impedances are proportionate (which in practice, means identical or very similar components/types). Maybe this doesn't matter for a strict impedance analysis, but it matters to practical circuits where the current or voltage distribution between components implies power dissipation in them, and a given component is limited to some maximum ratings in all three variables (V, I and their averaged product P).

For example, in a power converter, it might be that a parallel combination of ceramic and electrolytic is used, where the total ripple current exceeds the rating of each component type, and they need to be chosen (value, ESR, and number in parallel; and to some extent, stray inductance between them) such that RMS current ratings of both are respected. Too much of one or the other type would cause current to dominate in that type, and thus approach its limiting rating.

You will also encounter situations where the assumptions in (1) fail, e.g. the component ceases to behave as a 1-port, it has common-mode impedance to its surroundings. For example, you can't run 1GHz through a 50Ω 100W ceramic power resistor in any meaningful way: its body length is multiple wavelengths and will radiate to its surroundings. Even within a shielded enclosure, the impedance matching effects of those reactances will be visible, at each terminal with respect to that reference plane (shield).

You will also encounter cases where the RLC equivalent is simply a poor fit. Transmission lines are such a case (a one-port of which might be a TL stub, so we don't have to worry about the (2-port) transfer function yet). These give a rough fit by placing an RLC at each resonant frequency (i.e. harmonics), but a perfect fit requires as many LC elements as determined by the electrical length and desired bandwidth (which grows quadratically in their... product, I think it is?). These are cases where a one-dimensional approximation may be desirable: i.e. RLC circuits plus transmission lines, but the overall network still being analyzed as a point-like circuit (or infinite speed of light, but for the TL elements themselves).

As for references, I have regrettably few to offer; more generally, you may find insight from analytical network theory. Which can go all the way back to Zobel's (and others) early work on filters, e.g. https://archive.org/details/bstj2-1-1 , up to Zverev and others. Practical matters, like series-parallel connections of components in applications like power converters, may be found in books on such topics.

\$\endgroup\$

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.