Ukraine Turns To Flying Machine Guns And Autonomous AI-Controlled Drone Swarms To Counter Russian Numbers

from the crossing-the-line dept

It’s no secret that Ukraine is having a hard time in its fight against Russia at the moment. That’s in part because Ukraine is being limited in how deep into Russia it can attack using Western-supplied weapons. But mostly it is a matter of numbers: Russia has more men that it is willing to sacrifice in assaults, and more weapons and ammunition that it can use to pound Ukrainian positions and cities. As Alex Bornyakov, Ukraine’s deputy minister of digital transformation, told the UK Times: “We don’t have as many human resources as Russia, they fight, they die, they send more people, they don’t care, but that’s not how we see war.” Since it can’t match Russia in raw manpower and firepower, Ukraine has turned to technology to help it fight back.

In particular, Ukraine has been using drones in a way that is re-defining modern war. First, it is deploying them on an unprecedented scale. Back in December, Ukraine’s President Zelensky said that his country would produce one million drones in 2024. More recently, Hanna Hvozdyar, Ukraine’s Deputy Minister of Strategic Industries, stated that they would in fact produce two million drones this year, although these are unverified claims. In addition to sheer numbers, Ukraine is also pushing forward the boundaries of drone design. In May, Euromaidan Press reported that Ukrainian forces are mounting machine guns on heavy octocopter drones “to strafe Russian infantry assaults and fire into the trenches from above”:

Right now, Ukrainians are using two types of drones against the Russian infantry: grenade-dropping drones, and kamikaze drones. Dropping grenades accurately is extremely difficult, especially if the infantry is moving, or if the infantry has electronic warfare kits that necessitate operating from a much higher altitude, further reducing the accuracy.

The kamikaze drones, in turn, can only be used once. The development of gun mounts, combined with thermal vision and machine aiming, will change the setting completely.

Another innovative approach involves the use of AI to create a “swarm” of up to seven drones that can work cooperatively to attack tanks and carry out reconnaissance. The Times spoke to a Ukrainian entrepreneur working on this technology in Kyiv, Serhii Krupiienko:

“It’s the equivalent of bringing the steam engine into the factory all those years ago,” says Krupiienko, a software engineer who studied at Stanford University, California. “Our core mission is to get robots to do the fighting, not humans.

“They can communicate with each other, making decisions on which one attacks, which gathers intelligence — and they’ll do it faster than any human.”

Ukraine’s deputy minister of digital transformation Bornyakov told The Times that the country is testing another company’s intelligent swarm technology as well. The New York Times reports on a number of Ukrainian laboratories and factories working on other low-cost autonomous weapons. Bornyakov insisted that Ukraine will not allow any of these killing machines to go “completely autonomous”, without a human making the final decision. But when your soldiers are struggling against larger, better equipped forces in a war that will determine whether your country continues to exist in any meaningful sense, it will be hard to maintain that ethical position. And once that line is crossed, how wars are conducted will have changed forever.

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Comments on “Ukraine Turns To Flying Machine Guns And Autonomous AI-Controlled Drone Swarms To Counter Russian Numbers”

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86 Comments
Candescence (profile) says:

Re:

For what it’s worth, the apocalypse in Horizon was caused by self-replicating autonomous weapons that used bio-matter as resources. We’re thankfully nowhere near that stage, however, and hopefully, if we do get anywhere near that stage, it’ll be banned first. Unfortunately, we already have a Ted Faro in the form of Elon Musk, but it’s fortunate he’s not in the business of making weapons… Yet…

Anonymous Coward says:

No weapon (possibly except Nukes) has ever been banned on ethical grounds

We do not tend to ban weapons because they are too useful, militarily. In as much as the Catholic Church has succeeded in ridding the world of perfidious crossbows and the English longbow, it is only because they have been superseded by the browning machine gun.

The reason we could ban chemical weapons was because they had no conceivable use except to kill civilians. One sudden change of winds and suddenly you are hoist by your own petard. A mortar will do twice as good as what a chemical round might do, especially considering that the enemy is already prepared with anti-chemical weapons countermeasures already like gas masks, though nobody has really figured out how to counter an explosion, economically.

The only possible exception is nuclear weapons. Even so, despite our best efforts to prevent nuclear proliferation, states from the DPRK to Iran have still succeeded in performing the highly complicated process of making a nuclear weapon.

It is furthermore difficult to ban drones when they have been useful in asymmetric warfare. One of the many militias in the ME have been quite successful in employing drones to attack oil refineries. Cheaper variants of drones can be assembled in makeshift workshops in Ukraine, and ultimately that will filter down to every second-rate militia out there. It will be a nightmare to try and control drone proliferation, in as much as it is even possible to control the world’s supply of guns or bullets.

It is perhaps fortunate, though, that the world is also developing countermeasures in abundance. Jamming is fatal to the current generation of manual drones, but that of course wouldn’t apply to autonomous drones. There are, however, for example, countermeasures around the whitehouse against quadcopters, and laser weapon development is coming along nicely so you don’t have to lob a million dollar missile at a hundred dollar drone.

I foresee a time when autonomous drone swarms are banned, and it is when every military has effective countermeasures are already in place.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

To the nuke question, I’d argue that it falls into the same category as chemical weapons. Attempts to use them against enemy armies are largely a waste of time and money, a few dozen conventional explosives can do the same job more cheaply, with less risk of being shot down en route, and without producing radioactive fallout which may be accidently blown into your own army. Likewise, use against fortified underground bunkers is basically replaceable with specifically designed conventional explosives, with positions fortified enough to survive the second generally also able to survive the first. Leaving, as with chemical weapons, no practical uses for them outside the mass slaughter of civilians.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

The one that came to my mind was the drone shows at the Bejing 2022 Olympics.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gFfxu1TYY0

That’s 2,022 drones, all operating in concert. Just imagine what would happen if each one had a mounted machine gun and they could hand off duties between drones. It wouldn’t really matter if someone had a laser defense system; the only defenses would be a strong wind, an EMP, or a saturation of all frequencies used to communicate.

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Richard Steven Hack (user link) says:

Complete Nonsense

The number of errors in this article is embarrassing.

1) The Russians are NOT losing large numbers of troops relative to Ukraine. The actual loss rate is at least 5:1 in favor Russia, and in many places lately it’s been as high as 20:1. The Russian FAB-3000 is annihilating Ukrainian troops in large quantities. Ukraine is losing around 2,000 dead soldier per DAY and have been for months.

2) Ukraine is not limited in attacking inside Russia. What Ukraine does is waste their long-range Western-supplied weapons on pointless attacks on civilian targets inside Russia, which merely angers the Russian public who support the Russian SMO more fiercely. And then the Russians strike back even more heavily against Ukrainian military targets. The Russian do not and never have conducted attacks against civilians in Ukraine.

3) Ukraine’s other problem with long-range weapons from the West is that Russia has the best air defenses in the world and they have learned over the last 2.5 years to counter most Ukrainian strikes.

4) Drones: While Ukraine has been using drones effectively, they are massively out-numbered by Russian drones. The Russians were a little late to the drone game, but their industrial production far exceeds anything Ukraine can do. It is the Russians who are developing drone swarms with AI and networking technology. The Ukrainians are playing catch-up – and it’s far too late for them to succeed, given their massive losses in both men and materiel.

4) You need to stop reading Ukraine news from The New York Times which is nothing but a stenographer for the CIA-written Ukrainian (and Israeli) propaganda.

This war is effectively over. The Russians are taking their time setting up their final push to Kiev. They are in no hurry as they have complete control of the battlefield, their losses are acceptable given the stakes (NATO vs Russia), and their slow, grinding attrition strategy has worked excellently over the course of the war. In economic terms, the West’s sanctions failed utterly, and the Russian economy is now considered a high-income one according to the World Bank.

It was idiotic of anyone to think Ukraine could defeat Russia in any way, shape or form. Prior to the start of the conflict, practically every newspaper and Web site published infographics on the relative Military Balance of the two countries. Only a moron could believe Ukraine had a chance, regardless of how many Western weapons would be supplied.

And once the Russian military-industrial complex revved up, Ukraine’s fate was sealed. Russia now has a military approaching two million mean, and has increased weapons production from two to seven times depending on weapons system.

Ukraine has lost 50 percent of its population, fleeing to the West, and has suffered at least half a million killed soldiers and probably another million and half wounded. Almost all of the current crop of Ukrainian front-line troops are civilians given barely a week or two training before being sent to the front lines, where their survival rate is estimated at four hours. The remaining previously NATO-trained troops are being sent hither and yon to shore up defenses which the Russians are breaching daily and suffering enormous casualty rates that are completely unsustainable by any military.

Yet Biden and NATO continues to escalate the conflict despite the fact that neither the US nor NATO have any chance of defeating the current Russian military, short of using nuclear weapons.

And in that respect, Russia, again, has the best air defenses in the world designed to shoot down ICBMs and IRBMs and cruise missiles, whereas the West has ZERO defenses against Russian supersonic and hypersonic missiles – around 48 of them just visited Cuba on a Russian warship and nuclear submarine.

Let that sink in. Do you want to die for Joe Biden and his neocon cronies?

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

Do you want to die for Joe Biden and his neocon cronies?

The fight is against fascism. “Joe Biden and his neocon cronies” just happen to be the ones who aren’t rolling over for it.

If fascism is allowed to spread, a lot of us are dead at its hands anyway.

Yeah. This is a fight worth dying for.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

Uh.

Even the EU doesn’t want to be nuked.

As much as we’d like to just Agent 47/John Wick the fascist fuck and his Chinese backer, unless our hypothetical assassin also can magically destroy the leader’s nuclear stockpile, the only thing the world can do is to resist the invader conventionally.

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That One Guy (profile) says:

Re: 'This is all your fault for defending yourself!'

Better idea if the goal is to ‘spare further senseless death’: That psychotic wanna-be-conqueror Putin stops trying to invade another country.

Ukraine isn’t the one who started this bloodbath it’s positively absurd to try to frame them as the party responsible for not ending it sooner.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

Better idea if the goal is to ‘spare further senseless death’: That psychotic wanna-be-conqueror Putin stops trying to invade another country.

Putin isn’t going to withdraw his forces–why would he? He’s prosecuting a criminal war of aggression and has captured territory that Ukraine has no ability to recover without direct US intervention.

Why should Ukrainian men continue to die for a lost cause rather than the war being concluded with a negotiated settlement?

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

“Hopefully Ukraine seeks a negotiated peace soon to spare further senseless death.”

Let’s review, shall we?

  1. Russia negotiates deal with Ukraine where Ukraine gives up all their nukes and in return Russia promises to not invade. Ukraine agrees.
  2. ???
  3. Russia invades Ukraine

and now, Russia wants to negotiate … hoping Ukraine gives in again.

Then Russia will be looking toward Poland, Finland, France …. when will humans realize this doesn’t fucking work?

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:

Ukraine is already invaded, and Putin is more than happy to nuke the place.

Meanwhile, guess who’s next after Ukraine is Russian territory? Those countries stated.

And they’d be more than happy to break the Geneva Convention several times to prevent Putin from stepping one foot into their territory.

France, in particular, is more than happy to show Russia how serious they are with a nuclear strike.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re:

If you nerds are so keen for Ukraine to keep sending its young men into a meat grinder to prolong what is literally an unwinnable war, why aren’t you there in training, getting ready to join them, or at the very least selling your homes or other assets and donating that money to Ukrainian or international units fighting at the front?

Without direct US intervention (which would, of course, mean nuclear war with Russia), Ukraine cannot win. It has an unmitigable demographic problem.

That One Guy (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re: I'll take 'False Dichotomy' for $500 Alex

‘If you aren’t signing up to be on the front lines of a war how dare you criticize those arguing for an invaded country to just surrender to the one invading them.’

Well that’s an argument I suppose, hope you’re getting paid for shilling for Putin as I’d hate to think you’re doing it for free.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:3

So, why aren’t you joining the Russians and trying to prove the Ukranians that their defense of their homes is a bad idea?

Down in the proverbial trenches, that is.

Unless Putin’s paid you to defend his war online, that is. Then please, do tell me how much he’s paid you to do so.

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Rocky says:

Re: Re: Re:

“Let not any one pacify his conscience by the delusion that he can do no harm if he takes no part, and forms no opinion. Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing. He is not a good man who, without a protest, allows wrong to be committed in his name, and with the means which he helps to supply, because he will not trouble himself to use his mind on the subject.”
– John Stuart Mill, 1867 inaugural address at the University of St. Andrews

Only fools who know no history and those with a specific agenda appeal to people to accept appeasement.

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Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:4

Putin said he would never invade Ukraine.
At this point why should anyone believe any of this crap

Because anyone with even a basic understanding of great power politics realizes it’s not in Russia’s interest to precipitate war with NATO. Sheesh.

As for Ukraine: again, Ukraine is not an ally of the U.S. or a NATO member, but it is firmly within Russia’s sphere of influence. What happens in Ukraine poses no threat to the U.S.

JMT (profile) says:

Re: Re: Re:5

Because anyone with even a basic understanding of great power politics realizes it’s not in Russia’s interest to precipitate war with NATO.

And how exactly was it in Russia’s interest to invade Ukraine other than for a naked land grab? It was a preposterously stupid decision to make and the cost to Russia has be enormous. So why would anyone sane bet on Putin not making further terrible decisions?

As for Ukraine: again, Ukraine is not an ally of the U.S….

Incorrect.

…but it is firmly within Russia’s sphere of influence.

If by influence, you mean in a constant state of high defense against unprovoked attack until Putin and his regime are dead, buried and condemned within Russia, then sure, Ukraine is within Russia’s sphere of influence.

What happens in Ukraine poses no threat to the U.S.

What happed in Poland supposedly posed no threat to the US too. That mistake has not been forgotten.

Anonymous Coward says:

Re: Re: Re:7

That would be Hitler attacking Poland.

France and Britain had to defend Poland due to treaties promising Poland Grench and British involvement, ie, putting fucking boots on the ground.

Hitler didn’t stop at Poland, either.

Hell, it was CHAMBERLAIN, not that rat bastard Churchill, who, uh, tried to negotiate with Hitler. Being too broke to run an empire does that to you.

Man, you Russian assholes are especially thick.

The Probe (profile) says:

Why is the Ukraine war not ending?

The future of the world rides on how the crisis in Europe plays out. For the war to end, a lot of deals will have to be struck, including one on burying deep the origin of the Coronavirus.
he Cold War years

In a Netflix serial scripted against the Cold War backdrop, Russian KGB agents are embedded in American society. Like Joseph Conrad’s The Secret Agent, they step out from their shadows and from the comfort of their American identity only when they get orders from their handlers to execute a project, like ‘bomb a place’ or ‘kill’ someone. At times these KGB agents are torn between the country of their origin and their love for the American way of life. Many Hollywood offerings build on this ideological conflict of the agents and how they jettison their commitment to Marxism and Leninism and the stability of the Soviet state in favour of the US or the countries of the West.

Read the full story here –

https://theprobe.in/world/why-is-the-ukraine-war-not-ending/

Anonymous Coward says:

Re:

Sounds like you’ve got this thing all figured out now huh.
What is it that you suggest the world leaders do in order to quell the present day warfare?

Negotiate?
lol
The last negotiation led to the present situation, the russians lied again but they should be trusted this time because reasons.

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