Timeline for How much energy would this robot need?
Current License: CC BY-SA 4.0
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| Feb 8 at 16:51 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | @bukwyrm reading back through the thread, I see we are in fact talking about 2 different things. Sitting in a chair as the DemonLord suggests requires you to idle your robot so that it does not fall over. Laying down a humanoid robot into a sleep mode is okay, but it would still take a few moments to calibrate all of its sensors and PID controllers once it comes back online or its proprioception will get all messed up. I have been calling an idle mode standby, and you have been calling a sleepmode standby which I believe is the source of confusion. | |
| Feb 7 at 20:19 | comment | added | bukwyrm | @Nosajimiki this comment thread is already getting a bit longish. Again, we might have differing definitions of standby. But i, also, have robotics experience. And in the state that i call standby (no posture/position is held, robot will come back online without boot on button press) the power draw for multi-kw robots is in the single watt digits. Which makes sense, because nothing apart from some memory keep-alive and some temperature watchdogs is actually getting power. | |
| Feb 7 at 14:54 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | @bukwyrm Sorry, I checked my source's citation and 10-15% is an average across household appliances that contain motors, not the motors themselves. That said, in my experience with robots, standby power consumption seems to average closer to 20-30%; so, 15% was already me being generous. The reality is simply that there are a lot of factors that drive up the standby power consumption of a robot. So even if I am misinformed about any one of the reasons why they use up so much power, the reality is simply that they do. | |
| Feb 7 at 11:52 | comment | added | bukwyrm | @Nosajimiki Induction currents in DC devices? Citation please. --- about the 'Negligible amounts add up' - either the robot draws 15%, then that is not an addition of 'negligible amounts' (given the amount before was not also negligible. 15% of sizeable is not negligible.) - or the whole thing draws the sum of negligible amounts, then it's not 15%, but nearer to 1% | |
| Feb 6 at 21:16 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | So, even if you switch the power off to the motors, some electricity will still jump the gap and run the circuit. If you have a robot containing 100s of motors, gyros, cameras, and pressure sensors all over the body, that is a lot of circuits to that will each drawn thier own negligible current individually, but cumulatively, it adds up. While humans SPEND more energy in standby, we waste way less of it by storing it in stable chemical bonds. | |
| Feb 6 at 21:16 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | @bukwyrm An average laptop battery lasts 3-10 hours of active use. In standby they last about 1-3 days. If fully powered off, they last about 3-4 weeks. If removed from the laptop they can last for well over a year. Just connecting a battery to a circuit, draws a significant amount of power out of it. The reason for this is that the gaps in physical switches are relatively small which means that an induction current still travels between the connectors even when the switch is open. | |
| Feb 6 at 17:08 | comment | added | bukwyrm | @Nosajimiki no they do not. If you have a universal motor plugged into mains that may be somewhat plausible, if the switch is on 0, and not phase (though i doubt 15%, in a 1000W hoover that would mean 150W is getting burnt at rest, which would be easily detectable as warmth/heat) , but a robot has no motors plugged into mains, it has motor control boards using, at the very least, PWM. no activation, no power draw. Mechanically stopped servos/motors will draw power (sometimes stupid amounts at or even above nominal power) as long as they are powered , but not unpowered, as the name suggests. | |
| Feb 5 at 17:17 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | @bukwyrm Motors draw power when turned off, but still plugged in. The average electric motor consumes 10-15% of its full load just doing nothing; so, a not insignificant part of that 1kw/hr is wasted induction currents. You can optimize power waste through air gapped power systems that unplug themselves when not in use, but just running an electrical circuit in the vicinity of all those copper coils and other wires, wastes power. Chances are you will not get below the 50 watts that a sleeping human uses unless you physically disconnect the battery from the robot. | |
| Feb 1 at 21:39 | comment | added | bukwyrm | @Nosajimiki the boston dynamics robot is not in standby when using 1kW, it is active, but unmoving. Real standby would get the humanoid robot into some metastable position, ideally lying down, but mayhaps just locking knees and setting the head onto the ground, and then power down the servos. Then the processing hardware goes into standby, meaning keeping the RAM powered, and possibly a watchdog routine on some subprocessor going online every 100ms for 1ms to check for some wakeup signal. 15W is actually rather wasteful for that. Still 24h*1000(error) is not 'decades', it's three years. | |
| Jan 26 at 16:37 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | A laptop uses 15 watts, yes, but not a robot. A robot in standby mode is still actively running an AI to process sensory input and make decisions as to if it should stop being on standby and start doing something. This uses a LOT more processing power than an idle laptop because of the nature of neural-networking software. It also takes power to hold a robot in a standing position (assuming humanoid features); so, just standing still so that you don't fall over consumes power. Boston Dynamics robots for example idle at about 1kw to just stand and observe thier environment. | |
| Jan 25 at 22:52 | comment | added | TheDemonLord | @Nosajimiki - I gotta disagree - a computer that is on Standby mode uses 15 watts, a Human sleeping around 100 watts. A Human sleeping is about the same as an average laptop in use. | |
| Jan 25 at 22:24 | comment | added | Nosajimiki | "we consume power even when we are sitting down" <- robots do this to. Yes, a robot can be turned off without dying which is nice, but a robot that is "awake" and idle consumes a lot more power than a human that is awake and idle. | |
| S Jan 24 at 17:12 | history | suggested | user2357112 | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
Fixed capitalization. This is particularly important for calories, since capitalization is often used to distinguish dietary Calories and gram calories.
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| Jan 24 at 16:51 | review | Suggested edits | |||
| S Jan 24 at 17:12 | |||||
| Jan 23 at 2:19 | history | edited | TheDemonLord | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
added 3 characters in body
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| Jan 23 at 2:11 | history | answered | TheDemonLord | CC BY-SA 4.0 |